In my mind, if the church posts the links on their website as resources then they are encouraging the idea.

The idea has not been endorsed by leadership, but general preparedness has. So, given those two criteria, are you stating that local leadership cannot be divinely inspired to institute a program that incorporates 72 hour kits as part of the total plan?

I think those who oppose this practice can’t see the forest for the trees. Nobody is saying that church leadership has commanded it, and nobody is saying that it’s the end all, be all of preparedness. It’s simply a stepping stone on your way to overall and thorough preparedness.

Update me: Where have church leaders encouraged us to get 72-hr kits? This is a repeat of Ryan’s challenge, and I don’t want a cop-out answer.

I have specifically stated that church leaders have not specifically endorsed 72 hour kits. The “updated church counsel” to which I referred Ryan was not in reference to 72 hour kits, but to a year supply of food. The current counsel in that specific regard is to store three months of food you eat on a daily basis, and a “longer-term supply” of other foods that last a long time. More on that here.

Simply put: Preparedness is divine counsel. 72-hr kits as a mode of preparation is a man-invented idea originally designed as part of a civic defense program. Many members have adapted the idea to complement their adherence to divine counsel. This isn’t bad. The idea itself, however, has never been endorsed by church leadership the way food storage and other preparedness programs have been. Thus, to defend that particular mode of preparation as divinely inspired is problematic.

To quote a scripture about preparedness in response to Ryan’s challenge is, quite frankly, like quoting a scripture about family in support of an opinion that every family should have a weekly bowling night. Well, I’m sure it’s a great idea, but not specifically church counsel.

That’s actually the opposite of the general understanding of 72 hour kits. 72 hour kits are if you have to leave your home for whatever reason, and therefore do not have access to all the supplies you have stockpiled there. If you’re home, you can (ideally) get by without rescue for some time.

Conor, you show me when any General Authority has ever anywhere recommended to the members to get 72 hour kits.

I’ve already cited you scripture which clearly and thoroughly justifies any method of adequate preparation. Ignore them at your own peril.

If you want to know what modern disaster relief is like….?

Go get CERT trained.

Are you practicing that Conor? Or do you think going around asking people if they have their 72 kits will somehow prepare people for this?

Your arrogant attitude is quite alarming. Are you demanding perfection at the outset? Do you not understand the scriptures which teach the principle of line upon line, precept upon precept? Have you had no experience interacting with the Saints from a preparedness standpoint and seeing how lethargic and apathetic they are? Do you feel (as your comments seem to imply) that no training is better than some?

Nowhere have I claimed that 72 hour kits are the only preparation necessary, nor that that is all we are doing as a stake. Your rush to jump to conclusions and throw a fit that we’re not doing what you feel should be done is out of line.

How is your ward doing? Have you taken it upon yourself to train everybody in combat first aid, emergency search and rescue, and explosive ordnance disposal? Give me a break.

You see, you are just picking out 72 hour kits as if it were important for you (a private citizen) to know, and everything else wasn’t and would be appropriate to ask.

Easy off, soldier. I am following the direction and inspiration of our stake leaders, not implementing my own tangential preparedness desires. I think that 72 hour kits are woefully inadequate if left to themselves, but they’re a start—one, it should be noted, that our leadership has asked us all to work on. Cry about it all you want, but I’m following orders.

What has happened is that for many members, they have replaced the counsel to get a years supply of food and clothing and fuel, and replaced it with having 72 hour kits with flashlights. And then they go around asking members about this, as if this were some sort of measure of preparedness, or adherence to church counsel. It is Pharisitical.

Ha! This paragraph actually made me laugh with its glaring irony. You apparently got your Biblical stories backwards, because it was the Pharisees who demanded absolute perfection (on the outside) and completely ignored the spirit of the law. 72 hour kits are one portion of preparedness, and encompass the drive to prepare every needful thing.

I’m sorry that you feel that Saints ignore the counsel to obtain a year supply and instead feel prepared with a 72 hour kit. I personally have not met a single Saint who feels this way. Instead, they recognize that what they have is quite inadequate—they just don’t feel, for whatever reason, that working on their year supply is a priority.

I appreciate your comments (though I feel they are misguided), but if you wish to participate further, then you need to tone it down a bit. Most of your accusations are completely off base and out of harmony with recent counsel (which is not to obtain a year supply) and scriptural instruction (to prepare every needful thing—not just some buckets of wheat).

Conor, you show me when any General Authority has ever anywhere recommended to the members to get 72 hour kits. Ever. Until you do, realize that you are advising and surveying people to do something that is not church counsel. It may be a good idea, yes, but it is just one idea of many, and not what we have been counseled to do.

We are “playing disaster.” This is not role playing like missionary efforts. It’s more similar to “playing war.” We have gotten into several wars over the decades because we think it will be easier and less brutal than it really is. Same goes with this “preparation.” It is way more chaotic, dirty, and scary. If we really want to “prepare” people to respond to a disaster, we need to put them in a realistic situation, or at least acknowledge that going around door-to-door asking if the family is ok would pretty much only work if there was no disaster. If you want to know what modern warfare is like, watch Blackhawk Down. If you want to know what modern disaster relief is like….? Play “door-to-door” surveyor? How about observing, or better yet helping out, in an ER? You cannot prepare for emergencies without understanding the stress that will be involved. People will be scared, no one will have enough information, know one will no one what is going on, people will have to form ad hoc groups and work together. People will have to make decisions in seconds with imperfect information and have to balance out the risks of different options. Are you practicing that Conor? Or do you think going around asking people if they have their 72 kits will somehow prepare people for this?

Ok, Conor, if 72 hour kits are common sense and we need to be prepared in all things, let’s ask other questions: Do you have a semi-automatic weapon to deter invasion from a foreign force or rioting that the police cannot control? Have much debt on your house do you have, and what is your income? Can I see your gas lines to make sure they are earth-quake proof? Are your vaccines up to date? You see, you are just picking out 72 hour kits as if it were important for you (a private citizen) to know, and everything else wasn’t and would be appropriate to ask.

What has happened is that for many members, they have replaced the counsel to get a years supply of food and clothing and fuel, and replaced it with having 72 hour kits with flashlights. And then they go around asking members about this, as if this were some sort of measure of preparedness, or adherence to church counsel. It is Pharisitical.

I was on the High Council back during the years of 1998 through 2001 or 02. At that time, the Y2K thing was all over the news. As I remember, the Church did not officially have any comments or statements on Y2K. But all the members in our Stake were sure talking about it. In fact, our Stake’s dry pack canning machine was booked for weeks and our Stake President wanted to purchase a second one! But, the discussion on the High Council was that if we took such purchases seriously, the members would think “the Church” wanted all members to take the Y2K thing seriously.

But about that time period, Utah’s governor thought it would be in keeping with the Y2K spirit of things and have some kind of State Plan on community preparedness, and the Governor asked every County Government to submit a plan for such contingencies. So, when the State order hit the desks of Morgan County Government officials, it was simply passed on to the Stake Presidents in the area. The County apparently thought past counsel from the Church was solid, and thought the plan already existed through Church/Priesthood lines. As a Stake High Council, we were in charge of implementing a plan to satisfy the County Government. We wrote it up, and passed it through the Stake President and on to the County. As a Stake, we encouraged each Ward to call a chairman to oversee a calling tree.

But, in the implementation on a County level, I’m afraid that most normal LDS church members got the idea that this was some kind of “Church plan” when in fact it was not. The Lord’s plan of provident living and some food storage never entered into the government’s plan of emergency preparedness.

As Connor mentioned, his area has seen some emergencies, and preparedness for such emergencies ought to be done at some level. I think if his Stake leaders want to do such in their area, it is within their authority to do so on their own Stake and Ward levels. But, I think we are mistaken to project Connor’s area and his thoughts into an overall “Church directive.”

I’ve never met anybody who had a 72 hour kit and thought that they were sufficiently prepared, or that they were done fulfilling prophetic counsel. I’m intrigued that you have—what are these people thinking??

I think 72 hour kits are an important, but very small part of one’s overall preparedness. In fact, most people’s idea of a 72 hour is a scant collection of a few items that would make three days of survival nearly unbearable.

My wife and I have what are termed “bugout bags” (or, what I call “72 hour kits on steroids”). These are each comprised of large soft-frame backpacking bags chock full of all sorts of goodies that would make three days of survival quite enjoyable (or, considering the circumstances in which we’d have to use them, at least much less miserable than we’d otherwise feel).

So long as the Church leadership has never said “72 hour kits are bad idea; do not use them,” I think it’s perfectly acceptable for local leadership to champion the idea, especially if it suits the needs of the members within their specific stewardship.

Imagine arguing that it’s wrong for the local leadership in a tornado-ridden area to encourage its members to store a wrench next to their gas valve shut-off. When the counsel is for their specific stewardship and not in contradiction with anything from higher up the chain (and even more, in perfect harmony with the scriptures which dictate that we’re to prepare every needful thing), then I think it’s totally off base to say that it shouldn’t be done simply because the Prophet has not told us to do it himself.

…I’ve been told that the idea for the 72 hour kit was developed because that was the estimated time it might require for government assistance to reach you in the event of a major disaster.

Actually, according to the Fire Chief of the Lone Peak Safety District, the average for Utah Valley is seven to 12 days.

Not saying they are a bad idea… just agreeing with Ryan that we ought not conflate a government preparedness program with actual church counsel.

I could be completely wrong, but I’ve been told that the idea for the 72 hour kit was developed because that was the estimated time it might require for government assistance to reach you in the event of a major disaster. Of course, we ought not rely on a program designed only to keep you alive until the government arrives.

Common sense. Not sure where you’re from, but we’ve had our share of scares around here in the past year (nearby fire, a couple bad snow storms, etc.) A year supply of food doesn’t help you when you’re stranded in the car or have to leave in a hurry.

Someone tell me where the church has ever recommended that.

For behold, it is not meet that I should command in all things; for he that is compelled in all things, the same is a slothful and not a wise servant; wherefore he receiveth no reward. (Doctrine and Covenants 58:26)

It’s a mormon myth. The counsel has always been a years supply of food.

You need to go brush up on your church counsel, then. The current counsel is not a year’s supply of food.

All these games playing disaster I think are actually counter-productive.

Like training our missionaries by putting them in situations where they can practice their skills and methods in a safe, protected environment that allows for positive feedback? Right.

It’s like improperly training for something by reinforcing the idea that we need people in hard hats and flashlights going around to each house, or that somehow we can “organize” ourselves out of following the counsel of the prophets to have a years supply of food.

I think you’re completely missing the point of provident living. Having a year’s worth of beans and rice in your basement does not mean you’re following the counsel and the principle of the law. In fact, if you think that you’re done after accumulating some food, then I think you’ve totally missed the point.

It just makes us all feel good that we are doing something to “prepare,” so we do it.

Perhaps that’s how you feel, but the scriptures and words of the prophets make clear to me that we are to be prepared in all things. Practicing emergency preparedness skills, getting necessary training, understanding how to turn off water, gas, and electricity in the house, how to do basic search and rescue, fire suppression, first aid, etc.—these are smart things to do. In essence, they reflect the wisdom stated repeatedly in 2nd Nephi of acting and not being acted upon.

I hope you’re able to weather the storms of life with your year supply… but conventional wisdom, common sense, and the historical record dictate that some buckets of basic staples won’t save you from most of the disasters and emergencies that threaten us.

I don’t understand the purpose of asking people in the neighborhood if they have their 72 hr kit. Someone tell me where the church has ever recommended that. It’s a mormon myth. The counsel has always been a years supply of food.

All these games playing disaster I think are actually counter-productive. It’s like improperly training for something by reinforcing the idea that we need people in hard hats and flashlights going around to each house, or that somehow we can “organize” ourselves out of following the counsel of the prophets to have a years supply of food.

It just makes us all feel good that we are doing something to “prepare,” so we do it.

One danger of this is the possibility of engendering an elitist, exclusive attitude. I know a few “We’re going to survive while the rest of you unfaithful won’t” people, and they aren’t fun to be around. Their unchristian attitude, in my mind, disqualifies them from many of the blessings of preparedness, and turns their sense of security into a sense of superiority.

I’m not saying you are advocating this. Just sharing my experience in a form of warning.

A few things…

Latter-day Saints, who believe in modern-day prophets and revelation, have been continually commanded to store against a day of want. Whether that day of want be brought about by unemployment (as occurred twice with my family growing up), natural disaster, or some other scenario, we as a church have always emphasized provident living and self-reliance (of which storage plays a large part.
I think it’s common sense to have a backup plan. It’s all about redundancy (there’s the computer nerd in me speaking). It was astonishing to me (as one who has storage) to meet people in my neighborhood that barely had anything in their pantry, let alone anything in terms of storage. Seeing chaos all over the world drives home the truth that those who are prepared can weather the storms far more easily.
Compassion is, at least for me, a key element in storage. While I hope to be able to use the majority of my resources for my own family when the time comes, I in no way will withhold what I have from those who are in need. Yes, they should have wised up previously and stored their own stuff. But I’m certainly not going to watch them starve to death when I have an abundance.

Though I don’t have a solution for the greater population, the failure of your drill suggests that the network is too large and a smaller, more select group of willing individuals ought to band together.

While the organization does become increasingly large in size as you gravitate towards the top, the idea behind preparedness in the LDS church is to do exactly what you suggest. Wards (congregations) are comprised of anywhere between 150-300 individuals (on average), and within that unit are broken down into smaller groups and structures that allow for more individualized ministry and assistance.

But instead of grouping together with a few other survivalists and barricading yourselves off from the rest of (the unprepared) civilization, I believe the proper role of a Christian individual is to render assistance wherever possible. Thus, while we’re still able to do so, we’ll continue to work hard in our community to help and encourage others to become prepared.

This comes in a variety of ways. Our ward operates an emergency preparedness email list where we send out tips, suggestions, group buy information, guidance, etc., to help people continue to keep preparedness items in focus. We hold activities every so often to train people on some specific element that we feel is necessary. Church leaders continually expound on the doctrine of preparedness (both temporal and spiritual). And we will be meeting together as blocks (those groups of ~10 homes I mentioned in the post) to get to know one another, share ideas and resources, and work on common goals.

As I said, I think the best way to approach preparedness (while we’re able) is to inspire and encourage the community instead of building a wall between your storage and everybody else. Should it come to the point where somebody wishes to use force to steal my resources, well, then, that’s why I’m glad to have the second amendment on my side. But if people are in need and willing to work or exchange for something to need, then I’m more than willing.

Except for my canned dum dums. Nobody touches those.

Though I don’t have a solution for the greater population, the failure of your drill suggests that the network is too large and a smaller, more select group of willing individuals ought to band together.