Consider the variety of the messages that you hear—all the more miraculous with no coordination except the direction of heaven. But why wouldn’t they be varied? Most of our congregation, seen or unseen, is made up of members of the Church. However, with marvelous new methods of communication, ever larger proportions of the audience for our conferences are not members of the Church—yet. So we must speak to those who know us very well and those who know us not at all. Within the Church alone we must speak to the children, the youth and young adults, the middle-aged, and the elderly. We must speak to families and parents and children at home even as we speak to those who are not married, without children, and perhaps very far from home. In the course of a general conference, we always stress the eternal verities of faith, hope, charity, and Christ crucified even as we speak forthrightly on very specific moral issues of the day. We are commanded in the scriptures to “say nothing but repentance unto this generation,” while at the same time we are to preach “good tidings [to] the meek … [and] bind up the brokenhearted.” Whatever form they take, these conference messages “proclaim liberty to the captives” and declare “the unsearchable riches of Christ.” In the wide variety of sermons given is the assumption that there will be something for everyone. In this regard, I guess President Harold B. Lee put it best years ago when he said that the gospel is “to comfort the afflicted and to afflict the [comfortable].”

With such a diverse audience, many of whom are at the “milk” level of the gospel, it’s little wonder than as time has progressed, the gospel message has been simplified and focused on the fundamentals.

I was listening to Joel Skousen yesterday, and he made a comment that I wrote down – - speaking of those church members who elect to ignore the signs around us: they are… “People who willingly decide to remain blind.”

Sounds kinda like those church members you are describing, mormonlibertarian.

when I mention “food storage”. One person said, “food storage, what is that?” and then laughed at his own cleverness (a health care professional, highly paid)–

at least two other highly paid M.D.s of my church acquaintance (one who was always very kind, the other with a more prickly personality) have either laughed at the notion of storing food or said, “I will ALWAYS be able to buy food and heat my home with public utilities!”–(one with anger)

So–

You know, I can’t change *them*, but I can feed my non-LDS neighbors, and if those whose resources have been beyond mine come to me for food, I will feed them.

I will turn no one away.

Father in Heaven has no limits; He owns everything–

but I believe the church is in a wilderness, truly–

in exile.

It doesn’t appear that way, but the leaders must be very cautious; they are watched all the time; I pray for them; it must be a tremendous burden.

I think things are much worse than they appear to be.

I think we are closer to a ‘brink’ than it appears. Knowledge is power, and I have no illusions about being able to affect anyone else’s agency.

I believe we are living in the times when the very elect will and are being deceived. The warning has been given.

So, I prepare. I study. And I don’t expect to change anyone.

We’ve got a lot of work ahead of us if 1/2 of the church members will be unprepared. Some of the stats show that 10% or less of members have any workable system of food storage.

That means to me that 90% of the church might be unprepared, and unwilling to heed the teachings of church leaders. So, in order to get 1/2 of church members to be prepared, we’ve got a tremendous amount of work to do!!

Also, I remember well the Saturday of conference after 9/11 when Presdient Hinckley said, “The prophesy of Joel has been fulfilled….” This was a huge wake up call for me, and caused me to study deeply those prophesies.

Some of their words are said in venues not directed at the entire world-wide audience, as President Packer did when he received The Lifetime Freedom Award in 2009. He talked about how if we were to be defeated that it would be from within. http://thestarforum.wordpress.com/2009/07/20/president-boyd-k-packer-lifetime-freedom-award/

The Book of Mormon is a type for our day, and having re-read it again with my children, I am amazed just in Ether chapter 8 how much it feels like what we are facing. And if we do not “wake to our awful situtaion” we may be overcome. I have hope that more and more members will continue to wake up, but as was said in the talk by Dallin H. Oaks, the “arithmatic of the parable” of the Ten Virgins is chilling. 1/2 the CHURCH MEMBERS will not be prepared.

2- Connor has never presumed to speak for the church. That’s silly. He’s simply putting forth an analysis of why the leadership has made a marked reduction in the explicitness and number of their political leanings. I remember President Grant said we didn’t need to go into WWII the way we did. And the leadership was vocally opposed to FDR yet 61% of church members voted for him. What a joke! Yes the leadership is ‘milky’ towards politics publicly but we have been given plenty of guidance already. There are stacks of political talks and writings from Priesthood leadership from Joseph Smith on down. We don’t really need more preaching on the topic do we? Seriously, Connor’s argument #6 applies here. However, let’s not forget how overtly political/timely Elder Packard’s remarks were this past conference and the furor they caused. I wholeheartedly agree that Connor’s argument #4 applies here.

Of course Connor could be completely wrong for who can know the mind of the Lord on all things? I’m sure the prophet and apostles know far more than they tell us. God is so far above our petty partisan battles. He certainly cares about our Government but has His own agenda which transcends ours infinitely. But I do believe He expects us to be fully engaged. And He will guide us in our battles. And I also believe He wants us to have these discussions. HE has said that many in the church will be deceived. Are we to believe that there won’t be Mormons who are politically deceived? Harry Reid anyone?

This quote is a nice summation of why Connor’s discussion is appropriate:

“It is necessary that all should exercise their powers of reason and reflection, and thoroughly understand why they take the course which God points out. Intelligent obedience…is desired by our Father in Heaven. He has given us our agency to think and act for ourselves, on our own volition, to obtain a testimony for ourselves from Him concerning the truth of the principles which He teaches, and then be firm and unshaken in the performance of all which is necessary for salvation.” ~ Wilford Woodruff

“Many citizens today, for instance, are alarmed, and rightfully so, when they see a vast oil slick develop which may be headed for the habitat of wildlife or a culinary water resource. Isn’t it interesting that only the seers seem to be able to see the approaching tide of effluence flowing from parental permissiveness that is now in the process of engulfing so many? So few other voices are raised in alarm. The ears of the secular world are attuned to the messages that come from the Paul Reveres, not the prophets. There appear to be so many Paul Reveres riding about, issuing so many jeremiads and warnings, that the crucial warnings are being drowned out. ” ~ Neil A. Maxwell

I am, however, looking into it, and think that the best thing we can do is look to the prophets, the scriptures, and as someone pointed out, inquiring of the Lord if what that President said was political opinion, only directed at that time, or still pertinent/prophetic. We can trust in the Lord and the Holy Ghost, and have the words of prophets confirmed by Them. That is what I aim to do in my search for truth on this subject.

Thank you for a well-put-together ‘article’

You may be thinking of President Monson’s address in the April 2008 General Conference:

The face of sin today often wears the mask of tolerance. Do not be deceived; behind that facade is heartache, unhappiness and pain.

He who hath ears to hear…. They are still warning us, but we are not listening to what they are saying.

I very much agree. It’s not as bold and direct as it once was, but it’s still there.

http://www.worldaffairsbrief.com/pdfbrief/World%20Affairs%20Brief%2028%20December%202007.pdf

I’m repeatedly stunned to read those seeking to pick apart the words of prophets, trusting rather (it would seem to me) their own philosophies rather than pondering, reading, studying the words of the prophets and coming to a secure knowledge of their teachings, and how such teachings trump the foolishness of the learning of man—even in the most prominent of the government propaganda centers (as Charlotte Iserbyt, from Reagan’s Department of Education refers to public schools.) Perhaps this hostility and disbelief/and/or estrangement to truth as spoken by prophets is a manifestation of the “enforced priestcraft” of the public school system upon the minds of [LDS] men/woman.

“And none are required to tamely and blindly submit to a man because
he has a portion of the priesthood. We have heard men who hold the
priesthood remark, that they would do anything they were told to do
by those who presided over them, if they knew it was wrong; but such
obedience as this is worse than folly to us; it is slavery in the
extreme; and the man who would thus willingly degrade himself should
not claim a rank among intelligent beings, until he turns from his
folly. A man of God… would spite the idea. Others, in the
extreme exercise of their almighty authority have taught that such
obedience was necessary, and that no matter what the saints were
told to do by their presidents, they should do it without asking any
questions. When Elders of Israel will so far indulge in these
extreme notions of obedience as to teach them to people, it is
generally because they have it in their minds to do wrong
themselves.”

– Apostle Charles W. Penrose
Millennial Star, v. 14, no. 38, pp. 593-595

“… Now those men, or those women, who know no more about the power
of God, and the influences of the Holy Spirit, than to be led
entirely by another person, suspending their own understanding, and
pinning their faith upon another’s sleeve, will never be capable of
entering into the celestial glory, to be crowned as they anticipate;
they will never be capable of becoming Gods. They cannot rule
themselves, to say nothing of ruling others, but they must be
dictated to do in every trifle, like a child. They cannot control
themselves in the least, but James, Peter, or somebody else must
control them. They never can become Gods, nor be crowned as rulers
with glory, immortality, and eternal lives. They never can hold
scepters of glory, majesty, and power in the Celestial Kingdom. Who
will? Those who are valiant and inspired with the true independence
of heaven, who will go forth boldly in the service of their God,
leaving others to do as they please, determined to do right, though
all mankind besides should take the opposite course. Will this
apply to any of you? Your own hearts can answer.”

– Brigham Young
Journal of Discourses, v. 1, p. 312

“… convince us of our errors of doctrine, if we have any, by
reason, by logical arguments, or by the Word of God, and we will be
ever grateful for the information, and you will ever have the
pleasing reflection that you have been instruments in the hands of
God of redeeming your fellow beings from the darkness which you may
see enveloping their minds.”

– Apostle Orson Pratt
The Seer, pp. 15-16

“Do not, brethren, put your trust in a man though he be a bishop, an
apostle, or a president. If you do, they will fail you at some time
or place; they will do wrong or seem to, and your support be gone…”

– Apostle George Q. Cannon
Millennial Star, v. 53, pp. 658-659, as quoted in Gospel Truth, v.
1, p. 319

“We talk of obedience, but do we require any man or woman to
ignorantly obey the counsels that are given? Do the First
Presidency require it? No, never.”

– Joseph F. Smith
Journal of Discourses, v. 16, p. 248

“President Wilford Woodruff is a man of wisdom and experience, and
we respect him, but we do not believe his personal views or
utterances are revelations from God; and when `Thus saith the Lord,’
comes from him, the saints investigate it: they do not shut their
eyes and take it down like a pill.”

– Apostle Charles W. Penrose
Millennial Star, v. 54, p. 191

“President Joseph Smith read the 14th chapter of Ezekiel – said the
Lord had declared by the Prophet [Ezekiel], that the people should
each stand for himself, and depend on no man or men in that state of
corruption of the Jewish Church – that righteous persons could only
deliver their own souls – applied it to the present state [1842] of
the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints – said if the people
departed from the Lord, they must fall – that they were depending on
the Prophet, hence were darkened in their minds, in consequence of
neglecting the duties devolving upon themselves…”

– Joseph Smith, Jr.
The Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 237-238

“What a pity it would be, if we were led by one man to utter
destruction! Are you afraid of this? I am more afraid that this
people have so much confidence in their leaders that they will not
inquire for themselves of God whether they are led by him. I am
fearful they settle down in a state of blink self-security, trusting
their eternal destiny in the hands of their leaders with a reckless
confidence that in itself would thwart the purposes of God in their
salvation, and weaken the influence they could give to their
leaders, did they know for themselves, by the revelations of Jesus,
that they are led in the right way. Let every man and woman know,
themselves, whether their leaders are walking in the path the Lord
dictates, or not. This has been my exhortation continually.”

– Brigham Young
Journal of Discourses, v. 9, p. 150

“How easy it would be for your leaders to lead you to destruction,
unless you actually know the mind and will of the spirit yourselves.”

– Brigham Young
Journal of Discourses, v. 3, p. 45

“I do not wish any Latter-day Saint in this world, nor in heaven, to
be satisfied with anything I do, unless the Spirit of the Lord Jesus
Christ, the spirit of revelation, makes them satisfied…. Suppose
that the people were heedless, that they manifested no concern with
regard to the things of the Kingdom of God, but threw the whole
burden upon the leaders of the people, saying, `If the brethren who
take charge of matters are satisfied, we are,’ this is not pleasing
in the sight of the Lord.”

– Brigham Young
Journal of Discourses, v. 3, p. 45

While I had not considered the idea of Bush seeking some kind of apostolic blessing from President Hinckley, it would be nice if something to that effect could actually happen. But, since the secret meeting happened last summer, I haven’t seen much change for the better in Bush that could be attributed to such a Prophetic blessing. But I’ll reserve judgement on possibility.

While your assertions concerning President Bush and his relationship to the Savior may well be true, I believe we, as Christians who possess the fullness of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, must leave those things to the Lord. Ignorance and adversarial deceit are responsible for millions, even billions of our brethren and sisters traveling the wrong path. The Lord will forgive whomever he will, but of us, it is required. It is quite impossible for anyone other than the individual spirit to determine whether or not one actually knows Christ in a personal way. I believe we do well to leave those types of judgements to the Lord. At this point in my life, I truly fear doing anything which would jeopardize the progress I have made thus far in my relationship with Christ.

Perhaps I should explain fully why I refer to President Bush in the way I do. My understanding of the 12th. Article of Faith is one of the reasons and you would likely be able to make the connection I make without necessarily supporting the individual. I believe the 12th Article reads as it does because the Lord is bound when we obey Him, and I believe, in that way, if He (the Lord) has anything against President Bush as the leader of our nation, he President Bush) will be held to an accountability on that issue alone, and separate from his personal life. I believe there is doctrine somewhere dealing with the leaders of nations, and governmental positions which have leadership responsibilities over others even in much smaller groups such as a Village Mayor. I feel it is a whole different matter than George W. Bush, the man. Also, I respect the office over the man, just as I respect the letter of the law over the substance. Another similarity I make is the fact that there are many political figures with whom I disagree adamantly, but I still always refer to them by their elected title. It must be so, I believe.

It would, perhaps, surprise you to learn that I have been calling for the impeachment of President Bush for months now. He is clearly derelict in his Constitutional duties to provide safety and security at our sovereign borders, and he has clearly and even wantonly refused to consider the will of the people due to his equally unconstitutional efforts to create treaties and agreements with Mexico and Canada without Congressional oversight. I personally believe President Bush has brought about more destructive acts than any other President before him, but again, he is not calling many, if any of the shots.

As for the secrecy, I believe the immigration situation may have been a large portion of the topic of conversation. I, myself, struggle with my perceived understanding of the stance the Church has taken, and I disagree with it just as adamantly, but I am currently allowing that I may not see the bigger picture so I’ll allow for that possibility. As much as I cannot support in any way the amnesty route for immigrants, I am still considering learning Spanish, and I still believe, in the end, that there actually is a much bigger picture the Lord is looking at. We must always come back to the fact that we are ALL children of our Heavenly Father, and we Americans have left the door open for the Lord to justifiably consider giving this land to others.

I had never considered your theory about President Hinckley calling President Bush to repentance, but it is logical, and it will have an effect on President Bush whether he realizes it or not. The more I think about it, the more I hope you are correct.

Just one final thought, and it may be rather far out there, but perhaps the President of the United States sought a blessing from the Lord’s Prophet and was accommodated. At least that might account for the absolute silence. It would right be none of our business. What do you think?

It seems a bit silly to speculate, since we don’t know what they talked about, and I still think keeping a conversation private is not necessarily equated to “prophetic silence” even if they talked about politics. Really, though, it does no good to try to guess what happened, does it?

You bring up the very valid point that President Hinckley apparently has not been inspired to reveal what he and Bush talked about in the secret meeting. This supports my thinking that there is truly a prophetic political silence IF anything they talked about was political. But, we all sometimes wonder about some of those tenets of the Gospel for which there are not any good, hard and simple answers. Getting radical in those tenets can be dangerous, but we humans sure think about them from time to time. So my human brain has to sit back and declare that IF President Hinckley claims “no comment” because he is not inspired to tell us, JUST WHAT MIGHT COULD HAVE BEEN the subject they discussed?