It would be a shame if I were the only smart-aleck around.

Me and Curtis.

Here I was getting all excited because I thought you were going to vote for Ru-Paul.

Ru-Paul, Ron Paul, tomayto, tomahto.

And I think Stirling Allen would vote for himself. I don’t know why I feel bad for him. I didn’t know him or anything. It’s just sad. I bet his Strong’s Concordance is black with obsessive marginal scribblings.

Ron Paul is hands down the best man for the job, regardless of whether he is supported by an apostate person or faithful LDS.

And you’re right.. it doesn’t mean anything. :)

not that it necessarily means anything, but to semi-bolster fontor’s observation, it seems that both you and Stirling Allen plan on supporting the same obscure candidate for president in 2008: Ron Paul.

Yeah, until he got excommunicated… Not exactly the best source for orthodox LDS interpretation of scriptures.

In fact, if you’re willing to allow multiple fulfillments and fulfillment on temporal and spiritual levels simultaneously, then just about anything can be a hit. Particularly if you’re not fussy about exact matches.

You may call it ‘looking with the eye of faith’, but I call it ‘playing fast and loose’. Psychics pull that stuff all the time.

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Hold the phone — do you know Stirling Allen? He was really active in the Mormon/patriot scene in the 90′s. I remembe hearing about him. But have you checked his page out lately?

http://www.greaterthings.com/Word-Number/People/GeorgeWBush.htm

Here’s someone who’s really not fussy about exact matches. Absolutely everything is significant in his mind. Number codes, adjacent words, page numbers, everything. I actually think he might be mentally ill and need help.

Read his website and behold your future. There is a way out though, and it is Critical Thinking.

I thought as I drove, that I should write to the General Presidency to request we have these meetings at least once a month so we can partake of the strength which is so prevalent, and receive the blessings attendant with a gathering of the Lord’s valiant representatives. Perhaps I’ll do just that. It won’t hurt to try.

Anyway, I wanted to start with something positive, and uplifting before I consider this post, and what it means to me.

Once again Connor has left us with less than pleasant things to occupy our thoughts. I can only say that I know that what he has laid before us is unfortunately true, and yet I want to disbelieve it is happening right under our noses, as it were. This President has been permitted to abrogate so many of our constitutional powers that it seems there is not much hope left for us to do anything substantive about it as we have lost our voice in the Congress. We are truly without adequate representation, and it does not bode well for the immediate, or long term future as far as I am concerned.

There is but one hope for us, and that is the Lord Jesus Christ. Through His Prophet we are being led out of the depths of Babylon, and we must continue to hone our battle skills by immersing ourselves in the Holy Scriptures, and especially The Book of Mormon. We must take positive, and substantial steps toward emergency preparedness, and removing ourselves from the grip of indebtedness. We must re-energize ourselves prayerfully, and commit to substantially increasing our temple attendance. We must not lose sight of the promises the Lord has made to us if we will be vigilant in our stewardship of the most blessed, and wonderful land upon the earth. We must also do all that can to reverse the trends of immorality, and stand up for the truth, and Christian principles.

The Prophet Joseph Smith once said. “You cannot be too good. Patience is heavenly, obedience is noble, forgiveness is merciful, and exaltation is godly; and he that holds out faithful to the end shall in no wise lose his reward. A good man will endure all things to honor Christ, and even dispose of the whole world, and all in it, to save his soul.” (History of the Church, 6:427).

As I was finishing this post I decided to read the words of Hymn #19, We Thank Thee, Oh God, for a Prophet, aloud and poetically. As I read, I was immediately filled with the Spirit, and tears came to my eyes, and now I am once again prepared to continue to engage my enemies for the soul of this land, and leave them with a warning: This land belongs to the Redeemer of the world, and the Lord of this land is Jesus Christ. While you may conspire to remove the freedoms He has allotted to His Father’s children, you may ultimately pay an eternal price which, once realized, you will regret having ever been a part of this evil plot.

“Unless God has raised you up for this very thing, you will be worn out by the opposition of men and devils. But if God be for you, who can be against you? Are all of them together stronger than God? Oh, be not weary of well-doing. Go on in the name of God and in the power of His might.” – John Wesley to William Wilberforce

I understand your point of view. The definition depends entirely upon your usage of the word. In this case I’m assuming prophecy to mean any prophetic foresight for future events, whether it be intentional or not. So “Thus saith the Lord: such and such an event will happen” would be on equal playing ground with an event taking place in the Book of Mormon chronology that mirrors a similar event taking place in our day. Both exist to warn the reader of future events, and as such, are prophecy. You say tom-ay-to, I say tom-ah-to. :)

I would ask, how do you know that those verses were referring to Bush’s actions.

I’m not narrowing them to strictly Bush’s actions. We see many times in the scriptures that one verse or prophecy can have several fulfillments (usually it’s a dual fulfillment). I’m simply suggesting that this is one of perhaps many.

I really don’t think those verses were a prophecy, at least to me. They don’t sound like they are, to me. They are more descriptive. Of course the Book of Mormon was written for our day, and we can learn much from it, and it is inspired. I agree with the quotes you provide. I think perhaps I am just thinking of ‘prophecy’ in a different sense than you are. I would ask, how do you know that those verses were referring to Bush’s actions. I think you can learn a lesson by analogy from those verses; I guess I’m just saying that I am not convinced that they were specifically inserted into the Book of Mormon so that we could make a comparison to President Bush.

Like I said, though, we’re probably just thinking of the term prophecy in different senses. The way that you are viewing prophecy, for me, seems too likely to lead to hysteria and exaggeration, in my experience, and can be dangerous. ‘Lo here’ and ‘lo there’ can mislead people. So, I’m not saying you’re wrong, just that I am not convinced that those verses were a prophecy warning against our current president.

I guess I’m more of a ‘wise as serpents; harmless as doves’ kinda guy (with an emphasis on staying even-keeled), and you are a ‘shout it from the rooftops’ kinda guy. It takes all kinds.

Do we not believe that the Book of Mormon was written for our day? Do we not look to it as a guide and pattern for modern day events? In support of this I offer two quotes:

I have been deeply impressed with the beauty and power of this scriptural account in 3 Nephi, and with its great value for our time and our generation.

The record of the Nephite history just prior to the Savior’s visit reveals many parallels to our own day as we anticipate the Savior’s second coming. The Nephite civilization had reached great heights. They were prosperous and industrious….

But, as so often happens, the people rejected the Lord. Pride became commonplace. Dishonesty and immorality were widespread. Secret combinations flourished because, as Helaman tells us, the Gadianton robbers “had seduced the more part of the righteous until they had come down to believe in their works and partake of their spoils” (Hel. 6:38). …. And “Satan had great power, unto the stirring up of the people to do all manner of iniquity, and to the puffing them up with pride, tempting them to seek for power, and authority, and riches, and the vain things of the world,” even as today (3 Ne. 6:15). (via Quoty)

Our current Prophet has said:

The Book of Mormon narrative is a chronicle of nations long since gone. But in its descriptions of the problems of today’s society, it is as current as the morning newspaper and much more definitive, inspired, and inspiring concerning the solutions of those problems. (via Quoty)

I see what you are getting at, but I view it as more of an analogy. I don’t think it is wise to loosely throw the terms prophecy and fulfillment of prophecy around, lest one become a false prophet (or identifier of prophecies, if you will). But kudos for ‘likening the scriptures’!

As to the substance of the post, I agree that this is not welcome news. From what I know, I disagree with a lot of what Bush has done along these lines.